Entertaining Thoughts of Deception & Untruth

Bring into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ

Published on March 10, 2005 By preacherman In Religion

In the Second Epistle of John verse 7-11 the believer is warned against false teachers

(VS7) "for many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist."

(VS9) "Whosoever transgresseth and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God."

Against such desception and untruth, the Spirit of God advises the child of God d not even entertain their doctrine of untruth.

(VS10-11) "If there come any unto you and bring not this doctrine, (doctrine of Christ) receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

There seems to be a concensus on the blogs that there should not be an aggressive spirit of opposition to blatant untruth. In the above passages the Spirit of God admonishes his children don't even entertain their thoughts. I can tell you from the best Teacher the only way to thwart the lies and deception of satan is with the Word of God / Truth... and it must be agressive.

When Christ was lead of the Spirit into the wilderness and was tempted, what was His answer to every desceptive lie of satan? The Word of God, nothing else. He did not mince words, was not concerned with politcal correctness, just used the old, antiquated Word. If by chance one might have heard Christ response to satan, one might have said, He will never win satan over to His point of view. He sure want make any friends talking like that. Do you hear them? To be honest with you my friend, He was not trying to win satan over to Truth. He was thwarting satn's lies with Truth... He didn't even bid him God speed.

If the truth of God's Word offends, we might do well to search our own heart!

preacherman

Comments (Page 1)

preacherman

on Mar 11, 2005

Matt. 15:12
Then came his disciples and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

preacherman

bakerstreet

on Mar 11, 2005

No one said you couldn't speak the truth. There's nothing "christ-like" about baiting, namecalling, and backbiting. There's nothing "Christ-Like" about telling people you don't know that they are Atheists, or that they "Hate God and God's Word".

If you are really serious about "By their fruits", then look at the results of your actions here. You and aeryk haven't wooed anyone toward God, on the contrary, you have alienated people, insulted them, and set yourself up as the messageboard pharisees.

It's your way or hell. And don't try and say "God's way or hell", because very, very few people here ever question your system of beliefs. What people take exception to is the name calling, holier-than-thou junk that you guys spew.

If you guys care about people's souls, you don't show it, not in the least. You appear to me and everyone else I respect on this board to be mouths without hearts; recitiation without thought.

I challenge you, in the spirit of someone who genuinely cares for you. Look at those who Jesus challenged, and how he challenged them. Look at their reactions, look at their words, and then look at your own.

"Then came his disciples and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?"

You and aeryk DO act very similar to some people in the New Testament, but frankly, I think it isn't the side you affiliate yourself with. You survive on your own offense, and use blacklisting and censorship to hide how un-Christian your behavior is compared to those who answer you.

preacherman

on Mar 11, 2005

There's nothing "christ-like" about baiting, namecalling, and backbiting. There's nothing "Christ-Like" about telling people you don't know that they are Atheists, or that they "Hate God and God's Word".

Read Matt. Chpt 23

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites.
Woe unto you, ye blind guides.
Ye fools and blind.
For ye are likened to whited sepulchres.
Ye serpents, Ye generation of vipers.

What do you think?

preacherman

bakerstreet

on Mar 11, 2005

I don't think it is anything approaching the kind of 5th grade antics you guys post here.

You come up with a few sentences among the tons of material we have of Jesus being patient and caring while interacting with unbelievers. Go back and look at how much patience and caring you guys are handing out these days.

Frankly, I think He was talking about people who outwardly profess to care about people's souls, and yet show no kindness or charity to anyone that disagrees with them, or is considered "unclean" by them. People who brandish the words of God as weapons but have no other concern beyond the fact that they sting when they hit.

I can't vouch for how you behave offline, but as for your conduct of late here at JU, I would see the quotes you post being far more valid directed TOWARD you, than from you.

Myrrander

on Mar 11, 2005

I entertain thoughts of deception and untruth every time I read something you've posted.

bakerstreet

on Mar 11, 2005

"To be honest with you my friend, He was not trying to win satan over to Truth. He was thwarting satn's lies with Truth.."

That line keeps nagging at me. You may believe that you are deriding "Satan in us", but aren't you tasked to win those of us you feel are out of line over to the truth? I see you rebuking Satan here there and everywhere, but I don't see you going to any trouble otherwise.

How do you think it is going? Does name calling and derision seem to be winning anyone over so far? Does it seem to be driving Satan away from the forum here?

I suppose you will appease the doubts with "Strait is the gate", but in the end I don't see you trying to usher anyone in, narrow though the way may be.

preacherman

on Mar 11, 2005

Frankly, I think He was talking about people who outwardly profess to care about people's souls, and yet show no kindness or charity to anyone that disagrees with them, or is considered "unclean" by them. People who brandish the words of God as weapons but have no other concern beyond the fact that they sting when they hit.

What I see in God's Word is that Christ was merciful, loving and forgiving to some and unmerciful, impatient and untolerant to others.

It didn't have anything to do with those who went to church or did not. There were times that Christ was very patient and tolerant with the grossest of sinner as well as one of His closest followers. While there were those who thought they were the religious pillars in the community found his violent verbal wrath.

So what was the difference in the two responses? The response that Christ yeilded toward individuals was based on the condition of their heart. Here inlies the problem is we don't know the condition of ones heart, in fact we don't even know our own heart, but the overriding character of the unrepentent heart was it manifested itself with words of untruth and rebellion against God. These found no mercy, but strong words of rebuke for their stance in untruth.

When Christ encountered these individuals, He did not use political (religious) correctness to try and win them to the side of glory.

preacherman

preacherman

on Mar 11, 2005

preacherman

on Mar 11, 2005

I entertain thoughts of deception and untruth every time I read something you've posted.

What do you think myrr about Matthew 23? Would you think that Christ was too tuff on those guys?

Why do you think He was so descriptive of their unbelieving character?

What had they done and said that manifest their unbelieving character?

preacherman

bakerstreet

on Mar 12, 2005

Christ was God, and therefore omnipotent, aware of people's inner souls, and therefore able to judge. You are not God, therefore you are just blindly judgmental. Sure, we use Jesus as an example, but we can't forgive people's sins, and neither are we put here to punish them.

That said, I would challenge you, again, to go and look at your effect on this forum, how your message effects people, and how people are pushed away from God's word because of it. Jesus had the right to condemn people's inner souls. Ignorant of them, we do not have that right.

That's my problem with you guys. You don't jus attack people's actions, you go further, and say that because people don't believe as you, that they must "hate God and God's word". It's shameful.

I'll stray a bit into your tactics for a moment. If we are going to stand in judgement for those lost souls we ignored, how much worse for those we pushed away because of our own pride and childishness?

This has nothing to do with being "tough". This isn't "tough love", because there is no love expressed in your spiteful posts. You just berate people, abusing the scriptures, and leave them hating God's word. You use it as a whip, not the guidence it was intended to be.

I have no intention of dealing with you anymore. You go and behave as you you feel led. Led by God, I mean, not your pride and need to take out your angst on those who disagree with you. Remember that lying to yourself is still lying.

Fault me for posting this, but I am one of the only ones left here that gives a damn. I, frankly, have reached my limit. If I didn't care, I wouldn't devote the time and ignore you, as most people are now doing.

preacherman

on Mar 12, 2005

I have no intention of dealing with you anymore.

BakerStreet I appreciate your post and regret that you do not want to “deal with me anymore”, but I a least hope you will read this post to your response and hopefully you will search out the scriptures for in them ye think ye have eternal life and it be y that speak of Christ.

You answer to Christ's rebuke of the professors of untruth and deception as “5th grade antics”, choosing rather blindly to acknowledge Christ stand FOR TRUTH. Now you say it was because He was God and knew their hearts…. Right you are in both instances, He was/is God, and He could see the contents of their heart.

I have never professed to know the contents of ones heart nor does my post attack such. My stand is for calling into check the lies and deception propagated by an anti-christ spirit.

The Apostle Paul….. in the book of the Acts of the Apostles, confronted Bar-jesus (Elymas) and stated he was full of all subtilty and all mischief and called him a child of the devil and an enemy of all righteousness. Why such harsh words of intolerance BakerStreet,? Could Paul see the contents of his heart? Absolutely not, but he heard and saw his attempts to pervert (distort & twist) the right ways of the Lord.

Check out this quote from one of the familiar bloggers-

Religions Anonymous
For those who have been burned by religion

By Iconoclast™
Posted Thursday, March 10, 2005 on Religions Anonymous
Discussion: Philosophy
This blog is only for people who hate preachers, religion, God, etc. It is not for Christians. Any religious replies will be deleted and you will be blacklisted. If a religious person wants to refute anything here, do it somewhere else.

And Iconoclast asked the God within himself, "Why are religious people idiots?"
And the God inside him replied, "Because they think they're perfect. They think that as long as they believe, they can make no mistakes. Shun aeryck and preacherman, for they are Communists who will attempt to lay waste to free thought. They are fools."

JUST A NOTE- I DID NOT FIND ANY COMMENTS FROM YOU AGAINST SUCH A BLATANT ATTACK ON OUR GOD????????????

That's my problem with you guys. You don't jus attack people's actions, you go further, and say that because people don't believe as you, that they must "hate God and God's word". It's shameful.

Open more than just your eyes and ears BakerStreet.. comments of this sort are worthy of the strongest Spiritual retribution. I don't have a clue about your relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ, but if you do, you would do well to spend more time in His Word and pray an understanding of His Spirit.

watch and pray lest ye enter into temptation..........

preacherman

bakerstreet

on Mar 12, 2005

I have spent a great deal of time on this forum challenging people about their disrespect for Christianity and religious belief in general. You can ask any of our pet Atheists here and I'd be willing to bet that I have taken them to task on much more than one occasion.

I have also blogged on such: Secularist Bigots; The Intellectually Insecure, most recently.

You have the right to demand respect. You have the right to point out the hypocracy of people who would never insult Judeaism or Islam but run Christianity into the ground. You have the right to demand that your ideas be treated with the same respect as anyone else's.

You will never, ever gain that respect by handing people the same drek you are handed. You will never, ever stop someone from calling you names by calling them names. You will also never, ever accurately represent Jesus Christ by behaving in the same way that people who hate Him behave.

I'm not asking you to adopt some secularist, un-Christian behavior. On the contrary, many of the people you are taking to task are behaving far, far more respectful and "Christ-like" than you are.

Christianity isn't about yelling back insults louder than you were insulted. You have taken brief moments in Jesus' life and turned them into standard operating procedure, ignoring the bulk of this patience, tolerance, and kindness.

Perhaps I do tend to lean more on my ears and eyes, but I would challenge you to lean a bit more on them. Judge for yourself the effects of your behavior on people who don't believe.

Other Christians have to deal with the kind of antics you and aeryk perpetrate. People prejudge us to be the sort of person to berate and judge, before they even know us. Why? Because Christianity has been defined for them by people like you.

In the end, what matters is the image of Christianity you leave in non-Christian's minds when the discussion is over. Are people more or less apt to accept God when you are done with them? I think it is obvious the effect you guys have on people.

preacherman

on Mar 12, 2005

"I think most Atheists and people of faith are polite and tolerant of others' beliefs."
"I respect the beliefs of Atheists"

BakerStreet I read your article on Secularist Bigots; The Intellectually Insecure and I took the liberty of drawing two of your quotes-

This was the exact point of the article... it appears you have bid their anti-God spirit and doctrine God speed. By not checking (respecting) their untruth, do you not think that you are actually fellowshiping in the work of Antichrist?

The soul that walks in darkness must have the Light to expose its error? By leaving untruth on the table means we participate, somewhat in its deception. What do you think?

preacherman

bakerstreet

on Mar 13, 2005

I think that I can have respect for people that I believe are wrong. I believe that an Atheist need not be anti-God, and I believe most of them aren't anti-God. I think they are simply wrong, not evil, not some conspiracy out to get me.

No, I don't think I'm "fellowshiping in the work of Antichrist", any more than Jesus was "fellowshiping in the work of Antichrist" when He spoke with people the pharisees thought "unclean". He had the ability to separate the sin from the sinner, the ideology from the man.

You, apparently, can't. That's why you direct as much hate and venom at the people as you do at their ideas, and that's why you are useless as a spokesman for your beliefs.

What does the prodigal son have to do? Stand and suffer your derision? These people are "still a long way off", but I suppose you'd yell insults at them on their way home. Is that what the parable says to do?

You have no idea how close to belief the people you address are, and how little it may take to sway them one way or the other. You keep right on marginaling yourself and Christianity, and maybe the rest of us can take up the slack.

I'll say it again on my way out. Look at the effect your work has here. Have you drawn people to your ideas? Have you even drawn a small group among the many? No, you have created an uncrossable rift between yourself and others, and bruised the ability of others to speak spiritually without being judged as spiteful, intolerant folks like youself.

Thanks heaps. As I said, I'm done with you. Look at what you are doing, and what you accomplish. You are the wolf in sheeps clothing, imho. You blather on self-righteously pretending to care about people, and actively turn people away from God.

messybuu

on Mar 13, 2005

The soul that walks in darkness must have the Light to expose its error? By leaving untruth on the table means we participate, somewhat in its deception. What do you think?

I like to show light for how it's supposed to be shown: warmly and lovingly. I really doubt the pharisees are the ones we should be modeling ourselves after.

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